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Post by phillydude on Jan 15, 2024 14:11:24 GMT
Great finish!
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Post by seltzer on Jan 16, 2024 18:42:46 GMT
Congrats to you and Mrs. G on your PB's.
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gaz
New Member
Posts: 33
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Post by gaz on Feb 6, 2024 15:18:06 GMT
Thanks guys.
I'm a bit behind on updates... so here goes...
Mon 15th Jan: 7.75km zone 2 run Tue 16th Jan: gym sesh Wed 17th Jan: 1km repeats on the track - 9km total Sat 20th Jan: 10.3km trail race, treated as a training run, 1:05:18 Sun 21st Jan: 12km tempo run (3 x 2km fast), 1:04:58
Tue 23rd Jan: 6.6km zone 2 run Wed 24th Jan: hill repeats - 6.6km total Fri 26th Jan: 10km tempo run (4km fast) Sat 27th Jan: gym sesh Sun 28th Jan: 20km zone 2/3 - 2hrs 17
Mon 29th Jan: 5.7km zone 2 run Wed 31st Jan: 800m repeats on the track - 8.8km total Thu 1st Feb: gym sesh Fri 2nd Feb: 10km tempo run (3km fast) Sun 4th Feb: 22km zone 2/3 - 2 hrs 29
Mon 5th Feb: 5.8km zone 2 run
Long run distance really cranking up now; hit a PR for total distance last week (46.5km) and will be going further than that for the next few weeks at least. I think my next few long runs are set to beat my PR for longest individual run, too. This is a real base-building block, with the Bath Half just over 5 weeks away.
I've experimented with a carbon-plated shoe (Saucony Endorphin Pro 3). It's given me some issues in my toes (numbness while running and then pain afterwards), that I'm still working through. I'm giving up on those shoes and have put them on ebay. I'm off to London for work next week so I plan to dip into some of the big running brand flagship stores there to try on some alternatives. I've got my eye on a couple of Hoka options in particular (the Hoka Mach 5 is my staple daily training shoe).
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Post by phillydude on Feb 6, 2024 17:24:02 GMT
Glad to hear from you Gaz... looks like you are killing it with your workouts. Do you have a goal for the half? Love the new avatar pic!
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Post by macdiver on Feb 6, 2024 18:07:45 GMT
Last year my sports Chiropractor and I were talking about the carbon plate shoes. His opinion (based on various studies, articles, and experience with his clients) was that those shoes should be kept for race day only. One would need to do some training in them to get used to them and to break them in but they shouldn't be used for daily training. He had seen several of his long term clients who were sub-elite marathoners (2 1/2 hour ish finishers) get serious foot injuries using them daily.
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gaz
New Member
Posts: 33
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Post by gaz on Feb 7, 2024 13:08:53 GMT
Glad to hear from you Gaz... looks like you are killing it with your workouts. Do you have a goal for the half? Love the new avatar pic! Yep, I'm aiming for 1:45 for the half. I think it's doable based on my 10k time from last month and the amount of training volume I've put in since / will put in before the race. Last year my sports Chiropractor and I were talking about the carbon plate shoes. His opinion (based on various studies, articles, and experience with his clients) was that those shoes should be kept for race day only. One would need to do some training in them to get used to them and to break them in but they shouldn't be used for daily training. He had seen several of his long term clients who were sub-elite marathoners (2 1/2 hour ish finishers) get serious foot injuries using them daily. That's pretty much what I was planning to do - races only, occasionally some harder speed/interval sessions. I ran in the EP3s twice - once for a 12km run with 3 x 2km 10k-pace blocks, and once for my track session doing 800m repeats. My intention was to break them in a bit and discover if they were truly usable for me, and then use them in my next race if so. That discovery work has paid off as I've established that they are not the right shoes for me. It's a shame because I think I really did feel the benefit of being in a "super shoe" - particularly on that tempo run where I found I was hitting 10K race pace with a lower rate of perceived exertion. I've read that this particular shoe does need some breaking in, but the issues I was having did not feel like they were just because the foam was a bit stiff. I found a number of other runners on Reddit who had similar experiences in the shoes, and I think it's caused by one or a number of: toe box too tight, forefoot too wide, carbon plate too stiff, shoe geometry not a good match for my mechanics. I've done well in Hoka shoes so I'm hoping that I'll jive better with the Rocket X2, the Cielo X1, or the Mach X. What are you running in?
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Post by macdiver on Feb 7, 2024 13:44:18 GMT
Glad to hear from you Gaz... looks like you are killing it with your workouts. Do you have a goal for the half? Love the new avatar pic! Yep, I'm aiming for 1:45 for the half. I think it's doable based on my 10k time from last month and the amount of training volume I've put in since / will put in before the race. Last year my sports Chiropractor and I were talking about the carbon plate shoes. His opinion (based on various studies, articles, and experience with his clients) was that those shoes should be kept for race day only. One would need to do some training in them to get used to them and to break them in but they shouldn't be used for daily training. He had seen several of his long term clients who were sub-elite marathoners (2 1/2 hour ish finishers) get serious foot injuries using them daily. That's pretty much what I was planning to do - races only, occasionally some harder speed/interval sessions. I ran in the EP3s twice - once for a 12km run with 3 x 2km 10k-pace blocks, and once for my track session doing 800m repeats. My intention was to break them in a bit and discover if they were truly usable for me, and then use them in my next race if so. That discovery work has paid off as I've established that they are not the right shoes for me. It's a shame because I think I really did feel the benefit of being in a "super shoe" - particularly on that tempo run where I found I was hitting 10K race pace with a lower rate of perceived exertion. I've read that this particular shoe does need some breaking in, but the issues I was having did not feel like they were just because the foam was a bit stiff. I found a number of other runners on Reddit who had similar experiences in the shoes, and I think it's caused by one or a number of: toe box too tight, forefoot too wide, carbon plate too stiff, shoe geometry not a good match for my mechanics. I've done well in Hoka shoes so I'm hoping that I'll jive better with the Rocket X2, the Cielo X1, or the Mach X. What are you running in? This time of year I am using xero genesis sandals with v-toe socks. In the summer I run barefoot on the road and use my sandals for trails. I am about to switch to a pair of Luna sandals for my trail running as they are thicker which will give me more protection from the pointy rocks that are found on the Appalachian ridge in Pennsylvania and New Jersey. The thru hikers on the AT claim gnomes turn all of the stones pointy side up each night.
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Post by phillydude on Feb 7, 2024 13:44:35 GMT
With that pace you should be able to sub4 a marathon.
I meant to ask... was Mark Lewis at the Hyrox event you did?
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gaz
New Member
Posts: 33
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Post by gaz on Feb 7, 2024 14:55:37 GMT
Yep, I'm aiming for 1:45 for the half. I think it's doable based on my 10k time from last month and the amount of training volume I've put in since / will put in before the race. That's pretty much what I was planning to do - races only, occasionally some harder speed/interval sessions. I ran in the EP3s twice - once for a 12km run with 3 x 2km 10k-pace blocks, and once for my track session doing 800m repeats. My intention was to break them in a bit and discover if they were truly usable for me, and then use them in my next race if so. That discovery work has paid off as I've established that they are not the right shoes for me. It's a shame because I think I really did feel the benefit of being in a "super shoe" - particularly on that tempo run where I found I was hitting 10K race pace with a lower rate of perceived exertion. I've read that this particular shoe does need some breaking in, but the issues I was having did not feel like they were just because the foam was a bit stiff. I found a number of other runners on Reddit who had similar experiences in the shoes, and I think it's caused by one or a number of: toe box too tight, forefoot too wide, carbon plate too stiff, shoe geometry not a good match for my mechanics. I've done well in Hoka shoes so I'm hoping that I'll jive better with the Rocket X2, the Cielo X1, or the Mach X. What are you running in? This time of year I am using xero genesis sandals with v-toe socks. In the summer I run barefoot on the road and use my sandals for trails. I am about to switch to a pair of Luna sandals for my trail running as they are thicker which will give me more protection from the pointy rocks that are found on the Appalachian ridge in Pennsylvania and New Jersey. The thru hikers on the AT claim gnomes turn all of the stones pointy side up each night. Bloody hell. You're hardcore. Not like me with my near-maximalist, cushioned running shoes! Do you just prefer to run like that? With that pace you should be able to sub4 a marathon. I meant to ask... was Mark Lewis at the Hyrox event you did? Sub-4 is the goal... but I might make it the "B" goal. A few pace calculators I've looked at suggest that if I can do a 1:45 half, then I should be able to do a full in more like 3:40-3:45. I might give myself a more aggressive "A" goal closer to the race. For the last half I did, I gave myself a single goal, which was to have done everything possible to be in the best shape I could be by the time I hit the start line. So that was more of a process goal, and I need keep that in my mind over the next few months again. If I apply myself fully and take care of recovery/nutrition, then whatever happens on race day, happens. Yes, Mark Lewis was at the Hyrox event we did, but he was there on the Saturday, and we were competing on the Sunday only, so we didn't see him. If I recall, he didn't complete that particular event and walked off the course after the farmers' carry because he realised he wasn't going to set a big PB or win his age group.
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Post by phillydude on Feb 8, 2024 13:22:03 GMT
That was my recollection of Lewis' experience as well... which was kind of a dick move IMO, but I understand, especially in the heat of the moment. I can't imagine the additional pressure of being a "celebrity" in a mostly amateur event.
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gaz
New Member
Posts: 33
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Post by gaz on Feb 20, 2024 10:49:12 GMT
Weds 7th Feb: 400m repeats on track, 6.85km total Fri 9th Feb: 12km tempo run incl 2 x 3km @ 10k pace Sun 11th Feb: 24km long run in zone 2/3
Mon 12th Feb: 7.3km recovery run Weds 14th Feb: 9km speed session incl 2 x 2km fast Fri 16th Feb: 12km easy run, 1:20 Sun 18th Feb: 26km long run in zone 2/3
Mon 19th Feb: recovery run, 8.11km in 50:14
I've still been having some minor foot/toe discomfort. The tempo run on 9th Feb aggravated it. On that run I wore my Saucony Endorphin Speed 3s, which I've done over 100km in and haven't had any issues in previously. My current working theory is that shoes with a particular geometry are aggravating something, so I'm leaving the ES3s in my wardrobe for now.
Otherwise, I've only had minor discomfort on most runs, including on my longest long run this past Sunday, and most soreness has occurred between runs. I feel like I'm just about managing it at the moment but a deload week would probably do me some good! That shouldn't be far away, with the Bath Half now less than 4 weeks out.
Speaking of which, last week I went to London for a conference with work, and took the chance to go to the Hoka store and try on a few of their racier shoes. I've now sold the Saucony Endorphin Pro 3s that I mentioned previously, which were definitely a major contributor to the toe issues I was having, so I wanted to evaluate other shoes as half and full marathon racing options.
Rocket X2 - it's obviously hard to tell in this limited context, but I ran a few paces up and down the store several times, and felt like this was a great match for my mechanics. I tend to strike with my midfoot/forefoot, and the Rocket X2 feels like it has a big stack of meaty cushioning right under my landing point, making it feel like a bouncy crash pad.
Cielo X1 - this shoe looks and feels bonkers (Google it!). With this shoe, I felt the cushioning slightly further back towards the midfoot, and it felt like I had to adjust my gait slightly to land with the most cushy part. On landing, I could really feel the aggressive rocker pitching me forward onto my toes. I had a very similar sensation with the Saucony EP3s, where it felt like I was falling off a cliff and onto my toes, rather than landing on the cushion and then rolling through smoothly. Given my experience with those shoes, I felt like the Cielo X1 was not the one for me.
Mach X - I tried both the other two shoes 2 or 3 times, going back and forth; I only tried the Mach X once and briefly. Perhaps I didn't do it any favours by wearing it immediately after two fairly plush super shoes, but it immediately didn't feel as comfortable, and the forefoot landing felt much harsher. I may give it another go at some point in the future, but I decided it's not for me right now.
I would have bought the Rocket X2 there and then, but Hoka's 30-day guarantee only covers in-store returns if you buy in-store, and the London store is at least 90 minutes each way for me. Whereas, if you buy online, you can return online. So I bought a pair of the Rocket X2s that evening; they arrived on Friday, and I took them out on a test run last night.
They felt much more comfortable than the Saucony shoes. I did feel some minor forefoot discomfort, but no toe pain, and I attribute the forefoot issues to acclimating to the carbon plate. My run was supposed to be a recovery run, where I typically run in HR zone 2: for me, this means HR no higher than 127 bpm, and usually means a pace around 7:20-7:30 per km. These shoes did not feel good running slowly - the geometry makes you want to go faster! I ended up averaging 135bpm and a pace of 6:10 per km. Overall, I'd say that my rate of perceived effort felt much lower than normal for 6:10/km pace (bearing in mind that I'd run 26km the day before!), and my HR was definitely lower for that pace as well. For comparison, my average HR across 26km on Sunday was 138, with an average pace of 6:52.
I need to get a couple more runs in the Rocket X2s, but I think I'm keeping them, even if it's only as a 5k/10k racer. I'll do a longer run at some point to confirm if I want to run the Bath Half in them. If they go well there, I hope to use them in Stockholm for 42k as well.
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Aims for this week: - Get good sleep (I had some sub-optimal nights last week with the Superbowl ending at 4am UK time, then didn't sleep well while away from home for work) - Get a gym session in (haven't been for 2 weeks) - Get nutrition under control again (was a bit sloppy last week)
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Post by macdiver on Feb 20, 2024 19:24:02 GMT
That is a really significant difference in pace & effort with the new shoe. Wow.
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gaz
New Member
Posts: 33
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Post by gaz on Feb 26, 2024 9:21:33 GMT
Aims for this week: - Get good sleep (I had some sub-optimal nights last week with the Superbowl ending at 4am UK time, then didn't sleep well while away from home for work) - Get a gym session in (haven't been for 2 weeks) - Get nutrition under control again (was a bit sloppy last week) - I've averaged 7 hours 44 mins of sleep for the last 7 nights, with a sleep score average of 84. I could definitely have gone to bed earlier a few times. But better than the previous week. - Gym session done on Thursday. - Didn't track my macros/calories but felt like I was in control. Mon-Fri were good. Sat/Sun are a bit of a free-for-all at the moment but I can get away with it with the running volume! Weight was back down in the 84.x range so things are going in the right direction. Mon 19th Feb: 8.11km recovery run Weds 21st Feb: 7km interval session - 30 mins of 90 secs fast/90 secs walk, plus WU/CD Thu 22nd Feb: gym sesh Fri 23rd Feb: 14km run incl 5km @ 10k pace Sun 25th Feb: 28km long run, just over 3 hours Feeling pretty tired today as you might expect. I have a big week of volume ahead, starting with a 10km recovery run today, and then the taper starts before the half next week. I ran again in my Rocket X2s on Friday, and they were once again a delight. 5km at an average pace of 4:45/km, and an AHR of only 164, followed by another 7km at 5:44/km, with AHR around 150. I think some of the toe/forefoot issues are related to technique, and it felt like the shoes were giving me that feedback. Working theory: tight calves/lack of ankle mobility/lack of dorsiflexion means that I get lazy with my foot strike and land more heavily on my forefoot. When I consciously try to land more on my midfoot and roll through, my toes/forefoot feel 100x better. I've just had a podiatrist appointment this morning - he removed a small corn from my left foot and did some manipulations on both feet. Hopefully that will also help - my feet certainly feel a lot looser while walking around.
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Post by macdiver on Feb 26, 2024 23:57:09 GMT
Are you using the oura ring to track your sleep? The sleep score is something it gave as well.
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gaz
New Member
Posts: 33
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Post by gaz on Feb 27, 2024 10:21:28 GMT
Are you using the oura ring to track your sleep? The sleep score is something it gave as well. No, I wear my Garmin Forerunner basically 24/7. I only take it off to charge it, usually when I'm showering.
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